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Braces

Discussion in 'Modifications' started by Number6, Dec 8, 2013.

  1. Number6

    Number6 Copenworld Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2013
    Location:
    Dublin
    Car(s):
    2005 0.7L Copen
    I'm looking at stiffening up the roll a bit with a few struts / braces.

    Any recommendations as to which locations, such as the front strut or rear lower brace? What about brand? Any downsides?
     
  2. Adam K

    Adam K Copenworld Guru

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    Oct 27, 2010
    Location:
    Worcester, UK
    Car(s):
    Nissan Cube Kaizen
  3. alz2605

    alz2605 Copenworld Regular

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2013
    Location:
    Ceredigion
    Car(s):
    Daihatsu Copen
    VW Golf TDi
    What purpose do these braces serve? Is it basically to minimise the car from tilting to one side when driving round a bend? I can see how the undercarriage braces would help but how does the engine one help?

    The only downside I imagine are the extra insurance cost from the modification.
     
  4. Number6

    Number6 Copenworld Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2013
    Location:
    Dublin
    Car(s):
    2005 0.7L Copen
    The front one, basically, acts like a second wishbone.

    For me, at least, the insurance cost is virtually non-existant - adding a custom suspension would shoot up the insurance, but that's about it.
     
  5. trustafox

    trustafox Copenworld Guru

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2012
    Location:
    East Mids
    Car(s):
    Yes
    No, the car will not roll less in a bend. They stop the forces acting through the suspension being transmitted to the body of the car which will then flex the absorb the residue energy the suspension did not take up. The idea is to stop this flex and make the spring have to take it all. The suspension then actually travels further over its travel range than it does with out bracing.

    They are used for if you are racing and wanting extract the last bit of performance. Give some improved steering response/feel. They won't be of any real use for everyday tootling about besides you having to lug big tubes of steel around with you or to just look nice/sporty. The car will be heavier which will mean slower and we know the last thing the turbo copen needs is to be slower.

    I'd say with the suspension having to work more you may need to upgrade the suspension as well but if you was racing you'd be doing that anyway. On a car with soft suspension, making it use the suspension more might make it more like a boat bobbing on the water if the flex of the body is stiffer. If the Copen suspension is stiffer then if could make the ride a little more harsh. I find I get banged around in my car enough to want it any stiffer.
     
  6. Number6

    Number6 Copenworld Veteran

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    Apr 25, 2013
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    2005 0.7L Copen
    THIS! This is what I want to find out - will the ride be harsher, with more vibration and suspension play?
     
  7. Number6

    Number6 Copenworld Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2013
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    Car(s):
    2005 0.7L Copen
    I've been a bit cheeky, and posted about this on Stack Exchange

    In short, I'm wondering which of the non-upper strut bar to buy. I'm also wondering if I should save the money from not buying the upper strutbar, and instead spend it on a better back bar
     
  8. trustafox

    trustafox Copenworld Guru

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    What is a back bar? you mean rear of the car?

    Or do you want to get something for a dodgy spine :)
     
  9. trustafox

    trustafox Copenworld Guru

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    Nov 19, 2012
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    East Mids
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    In late answer to your question. I don't think the ride will be harsher, unless you put them everywhere which might stiffen things up so much it transfers vibrations through to you (and your dodgy spine :) ) as there is less take up in twisting of the body. The suspension will be the same so vibration passing the shocks/springs should be about the same.
     
  10. Number6

    Number6 Copenworld Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2013
    Location:
    Dublin
    Car(s):
    2005 0.7L Copen
    My spine is already bad! I'm talking about all the bars apart from the one in the engine.

    I think the sway bar itself is the best bet, just wondering if anyone has any real world experience on which would be the best for an unmodified suspension, to give the best value for money
     
  11. trustafox

    trustafox Copenworld Guru

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    Nov 19, 2012
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    Ask Adam, he has an upper front strut bar.

    Something at the front would help more for steering as it sharpens it up. The small rear might be quite flexible though in comparison to the front.
     
  12. Crystal copen

    Crystal copen Copenworld Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2012
    What's the quality like of the Ultra Braces? I've been tempted to get the set for the Saab but no one seems to run them :(
     
  13. Number6

    Number6 Copenworld Veteran

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    Apr 25, 2013
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    2005 0.7L Copen
    I've heard good things, Crystal. I'm based in Ireland, but the only decent vendor wrt price looks to be the UK based http://cre8autoworx.co.uk/ .

    I think I'm going to go for the sway bar, as opposed to the strut bar or any of the tie bars, unless someone can give me advice to the contrary.
     
  14. Adam K

    Adam K Copenworld Guru

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    Oct 27, 2010
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    Worcester, UK
    Car(s):
    Nissan Cube Kaizen
    I have the D Sport front strut fitted, honestly I didn't really notice much of a difference.
    Maybe I just don't go around round about fast enough? It does look nice though.

    http://www.dsport-web.com/copen/60.html

    I also have the D Sport rear sway bar (same as the rear Sway Bar UR-AR19-381 from Ultra Racing). Absolutley no difference.

    http://www.dsport-web.com/copen/17_b.html

    I spoke to Scooty at the KKITP two years back about bracing. He said the best improvement he noticed was with one of these:
    Tanabe Sustec UBD5 under brace

    http://minkara.carview.co.jp/smart/...00/003/543/823/3543823/p1.jpg?ct=492905c1211b

    So I would go with the Ultra Racing 4-Point Front H-Brace (UR-LA4-1667)' or try to get a Tanabe, I have seen one on eBay before.
     
  15. scooty

    scooty Copenworld Regular

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2009
    Location:
    Cologne, Germany
    Car(s):
    2 x Daihatsu Copen, RHD
    1 x Daihatsu Trevis
    Absolutely agree with Adam, the most noticeable one is the Tanabe Sustec UBD5 under brace. It really is doing a perfect job.

    [​IMG]
    Photo by fjutsha@forum.micro-roadster.de

    Don't know anyone yet with the Ultra Racing 4-Point Front H-Brace (UR-LA4-1667). But could be worth a try.

    Andreas
     

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  16. trustafox

    trustafox Copenworld Guru

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    I'm not surprised if you don't notice much Adam as for one the Copen is low and doesn't roll much anyway. Also, as its a narrow car it may be less prone to twisting up and down than if it had been wider like most cars. Plus unless you drive it quite hard, turns and bends, then what it gives is not being taken advantage of. That is, it doesn't do much when driving straight.
     

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