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Loss of power - turbo dead?

Discussion in 'Problems, Fixes, Tips...' started by Freebird, Jan 10, 2011.

  1. Freebird

    Freebird Copenworld Newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2011
    Location:
    Merstham, Surrey, UK.
    Car(s):
    My Daughter has a Copen.
    Hi all

    My name is Glen and I have a 23 year old Daugther Katie who has owned her Copen for just over two years. Yesterday - on her birthday, it lost a lot of power barely capable of 60mph apparently.

    I connected an OBD code reader to it tonight and no codes were registered and on driving it it seemed like there was no boost (nor whistle) from the turbo. There are no loose connections to be found and I suspect the turbo has seized. Though I have always told her to keep it serviced, she prefers to spend her money on clothes and shoes! It has never used any oil, but the quality of that in the sump is an unknown.

    So, is there an easy way of identifying a dead turbo? and should I need to get one, where can I get one from? Second hand preferably.

    I can fit it myself having been playing with cars and bikes for 35 years or so.

    Any help greatly appreciated

    Cheers

    Glen
     
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  2. smx

    smx Copenworld Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2010
    This chap might be worth an email regarding a used turbo:

    Ebay Link
     
  3. Freebird

    Freebird Copenworld Newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2011
    Location:
    Merstham, Surrey, UK.
    Car(s):
    My Daughter has a Copen.
    Fantastic, many thanks. I have sent him a message.

    Just for info a new one from Daihatsu is a whopping £1336!!!:-((

    Cheers

    Glen.
     
  4. Adam K

    Adam K Copenworld Guru

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2010
    Location:
    Worcester, UK
    Car(s):
    Nissan Cube Kaizen
  5. Freebird

    Freebird Copenworld Newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2011
    Location:
    Merstham, Surrey, UK.
    Car(s):
    My Daughter has a Copen.
    Yeah, there are a couple of £600 engines on the 'bay but neither has got a turbo and the bloke selling them hasn't got one either.

    The guy in Poland has got one though, but don't shout about it - I want it if mine really is dead. I will be getting stuck into it tomorrow.

    Cheers

    Glen.
     
  6. Freebird

    Freebird Copenworld Newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2011
    Location:
    Merstham, Surrey, UK.
    Car(s):
    My Daughter has a Copen.
    Hi All

    The turbo is deffo dead. The bearings in the middle have failed.:mad:

    Please make sure you do change your oil regularly - it is not a nice job I can tell you!:(

    Glen.
     
  7. smx

    smx Copenworld Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2010
    I'm slightly paranoid about my turbo failing so i have atendancy to change the oil a bit more often than 6 months and allways use fully synth.

    Not knowing alot about turbo's what actually happens and breaks and hows it realted to the oil? You mention the bearings, do they seaze up with dirty oil?

    Thanks, Andrew
     
  8. Freebird

    Freebird Copenworld Newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2011
    Location:
    Merstham, Surrey, UK.
    Car(s):
    My Daughter has a Copen.
    Hi Andrew

    Forgive me if I'm telling you stuff you already know here.

    Inside the body of the Turbo is a small shaft with an impeller (like a tapered fan) on each end. One fan is driven round as very high speed by the exhaust gases, the fan one the other end then compresses the air going into the engine.

    When I say very high speed, I mean 150,000 RPM. The shaft rotates on two tiny roller bearings, one on each end. These need a supply of clean oil at that kind of speed or they end up like my daughter's ones - very dead indeed. The oil is fed into the top of the turbo body, lubricates the bearings and then drains back to the sump through a pipe underneath.

    There is a small volume of oil in the top of the turbo housing to feed the bearings while the turbo slows down after the engine is switched off. For this reason it's always a good idea to let the engine idle for a few seconds before switching it off and it's NEVER a good idea to rev it up before switching it off or the oil can be consumed before the turbo stops spinning.

    So, you are right to err on the safe side when it comes to oil changes. The recommened oil is 5/30w.

    Hope this helps a bit.

    Glen.
     
  9. smx

    smx Copenworld Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2010
    Thats really interesting Glen, Thank you!

    Bearing the turbo in mind does anyone use or recommmend / not recommend using things like engine flush when changing oil?

    With the copen i have decided to do all the servicing myself, most of the basics i know but the copen is a bit different and slightly more temperamental to the little things compared to any of my previous cars.

    Thanks again, Andrew.
     
  10. neill70

    neill70 Copenworld Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2010
    Location:
    notts
    Car(s):
    copen vivid
    impreza wrx
    arosa sport
    yamaha ybr 125 custom
    over £1300 for a new turbo! for that money i could buy a turbo rated to 700bhp for my scooby, daihatsu prices seem to be way ott, i just got an oil filter from my local dealer for £19 which is more than any other i have ever bought.
    hope you can get a new one sorted.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2011
  11. honeyjew

    honeyjew Copenworld Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2009
    Yes, the cost of parts is outrageous. Very much in the Porsche, Ferrari territory in way of pricing. Two of my recent purchases and their prices:

    Driverside wiper arm: £86.01 !!!!!
    Offside front shock absorber: £209.71 (w/o installation)

    Outrageous!
     
  12. smx

    smx Copenworld Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2010
    Pricey! How did you blow a shock?
     
  13. honeyjew

    honeyjew Copenworld Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2009
    No idea. It was fine, then I took it to the dealers to get new tyres put on. Afterwards it didn't feel right, nor would it steer straight when the steering wheel was held straight. So I took it back, thinking they would just align it - but they said the shock was gone. They wouldn't replace it under warranty either because of "potholes". When picking it up I asked if it had fixed the steering problem, they said yes and their head mechanic had driven it and it was fine. It wasn't fine, it was still the same (albeit it did feel a bit better).
     
  14. smx

    smx Copenworld Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2010
    That sucks, i thought blowing a shock would be quite a major thing, obviously not!
     
  15. Freebird

    Freebird Copenworld Newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2011
    Location:
    Merstham, Surrey, UK.
    Car(s):
    My Daughter has a Copen.
    Hi Neill et all

    The best price I could get was £747.60 all inclusive from turbochargerrepairs.com. Genuine IHI turbo. A couple of other companies asked £834.00 plus P+P. It just goes to show how of a much of a mark up the main dealers (or should that be stealers) whack on.

    It should be here on Monday, so weather permitting I will fit it on 29th.

    Glen.
     
  16. Freebird

    Freebird Copenworld Newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2011
    Location:
    Merstham, Surrey, UK.
    Car(s):
    My Daughter has a Copen.
    Well, time for an update.

    I fitted the new turbo this afternoon and reassembled the front of the car. I changed the oil, but also wanted to warm it up then drain it again and re-fill it, just to make sure it was as clean as could be.

    So, I took it out for a drive, never having actually driven it far before and was pleasently surprised at how well it goes and handles. Very much like my wifes MX5 actually.

    I got home ready to drain the oil and found I had made a fundamental ommision on re-assemlby. I had forgotten to re-connect the bonnet release cable!

    So now I can't open the bonnet. I have managed to get the grill off without breaking too much off it. It's dark now and after 3 hours work I'm fed up, I can't see the latch well enough to find out how to jimmy it. If anyone has done this, I would be grateful for their experiences, though it's kind of unlikely me thinks.

    Ho Hum.

    Glen.
     
  17. Rex

    Rex Copenworld Pioneer

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2009
    Location:
    Cardiff
    Car(s):
    Copen
    Hi Glen,

    I think you should be able to open the bonnet with the grill removed. To help, I've just taken a couple of pictures.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Good luck
    Rex.
     
  18. Freebird

    Freebird Copenworld Newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2011
    Location:
    Merstham, Surrey, UK.
    Car(s):
    My Daughter has a Copen.
    Thanks Rex, but you can't, your really can't and believe me I tried.

    As luck would have it a mate's wife has got a Copen, so I could see from hers what I needed to do. Seemed so simple to release the latch with the bonnet up, but even after making a speciel tool to reach right in there, it proved impossible with the bonnet shut. When the latch activates, the bit with the cable on disappears inside.

    In the end I resorted to sawing through the bar that is riveted to the bonnet. It actually took longer to open the bonnet than it did to fit the Turbo :mad:
     
  19. Rex

    Rex Copenworld Pioneer

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2009
    Location:
    Cardiff
    Car(s):
    Copen
    Oh dear FB, I take your point. I hope there was not too much damage.

    Rex.
     
  20. kaz_1000

    kaz_1000 Copenworld Newbie

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2009
    Location:
    West Yorkshire
    Car(s):
    Copen
    :( my turbo appears to be dead. I have been trying to find out whereabouts it is looking at the manual but it doesn't show it anywhere. Can anyone help me with this as my OH is currently taking the copen to work this week and I could get him to take a look in his lunch time!
     
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